LibriumArcana.Games

Alright this is for the game Hearts of Iron II Doomsday. It's a game where you lead a nation (over 170 nations to chose from) from 1936 to 1953.

Date of map, Jan 1st 1936. Main Nations shown.

Blue = United States
Grey = Confederated States
Mustard = Republic of Deseret
Pale Yellow = Republic of Texas
Green = Republic of California
Pink = Canada/United Kingdom

History to Date: Or How the Fuck did we get here?

1863- Lincoln dies, Grant and Sherman killed in action.

1864- McClellan elected President, calls cease fire

1865- UK moderates finial treaty, promises to protect CSA independence.
American Civil War named North American Great War (later renamed 1st North American Great War)

1865- CSA economy in free fall, becomes totally economically dependent on European powers. Some areas, such as Texas avoid total dependence but cannot be considered wealthy by any stretch of the imagination. In order to achieve debt forgiveness and money, the CSA resorts to basically selling troop units off to it's allies. CSA troops are sent to Mexico to prop up France's Maximilian.

1870- Due to cross border raiding, Texas begins to purpose a more militant policy in Mexico, the other CSA states (expecting New Mexico and South Oklahoma which answer to Austin, not Richmond) object. Texas suceeds from the CSA, the US backs Texas, threating war, so it is allowed to leave.

1872- Maximillan's government falls, CSA troops fight their way from Central Mexico to ports on the Yutcan, taking Maximallian and his family with them. They are lauded in France and else where as heroes, meanwhile the Mexicans wonder what else they can do with their US made rifles.

1873- Texas and Mexico go to war.

1875- Increasingly tense confrontations between the Mormon church and the US government in the area, the settlers of Utah announce their session from the Union and the formation of the state of Deseret. Federal troops march out and war crimes are commited by both sides.

1876- California suceeds in protest of the conduct of Federal Troops both in Utah and on Californian soil, searching for "hidden mormons."

1877- Fresh from the conquest of Mexico, Texas declares war on the US in support of Deseret and California. The CSA remains neutral.

1878- Large waves of Mexican "draftees" wear down Federal troops, who are also suffering guriella attacks from Mormon militias. meanwhile the war grows less popular at home, as in the words of one writer "thousands have died to keep a collection of deserts and mountains within the Union, inhabited by barbarous peoples that would either have to be wiped out or forced into civilized behavior had to great a cost."

1879- California and Deseret have independence recognized. Top selling book in Britain "Study of American History, the dangers of Mob Rule" (2nd Great North American War)

1884- Western Alliance Treaty, Texas, California and Deseret sign a military and economic alliance.

1885- CSA and USA sign the "gentlemen's agreement" and understanding that they hate and want to hurt the Westerners more then they hate and want to hurt each other. US companies begin to invest in the CSA.

1898- The CSN Battlecruiser Florida explodes in Havanna habor. The CSA declares war on Spain.

1898- The Western Alliance is bribed into declaring war on the CSA.

1898- The USA declares War on the Western Alliance and on Spain.

1900- Oklahoma City stands under seige for 315 days without relief before Federal push the Texas Guard back. Norweign Reporter Valberg becomes world famous for publishing his notes in the book "Unbreakable, the Seige of Oklahoma City"

1905- Spain surrenders and the Western Alliance agrees to end the war. The US gains Spain's Pacific holdings and the CSA gains Cuba. 3rd Great North American War ends.

1915- CSA and USA enter WWI, Western Alliance is graphically and openly threatened by the British Empire's Ambassador Sir Kemmish to behave or be utterly destroyed root and branch. The Western Alliance remains nuetral through out the war. The Americans send roughly 2 million men to war.

1917- World War I ends.

1920s- Boom Time.

1930s- Depression.

1936 game starts.

Now that's what I have for this world. The map above is final. I don't want to dick with North America any more okay?

What I need and would like help with is figuring out what the rest of the world should look like and what kind of events should occur after 1936. Should the Western Alliance be cozy with Imperial Japan? Did the Soviets come to power or what? Etc, etc, etc.

Events are preprogramed in the game they fire when certain condaintions are met. For example the German Annexation of Austria is an event. I am taking suggestions for these. Also feel free to offer history help to flesh out the timeline.

Thank you.

As I've said over IM, you could write events to permit the players to make the decision. Events to turn any state fascist or communist, etc.

I'm not sure how different European history would be at this point save that with the USA and CSA entering WW1 earlier, and with both probably having larger armies than the historical US Army of June 1914, a Central Powers defeat may happen earlier. I'm not sure if 1916 is early enough to save the Czar though.

One possibility is that post-war will be different. Woodrow Wilson will never be US President now, and the political landscape changes. The two Unions may be more eager to intervene in the Russian Civil War, and with enough effort even Trotsky's brilliance won't be enough to save the Soviet Union. Alternatively, the Russian CW could end in stale-mate with the Communists holding on modern European Russia, more of White Russian being incorporated into the Polish Republic, an independent Ukrainian state, and united Don-Kuban-Urals-Siberian state with the surviving Romanovs on the throne (for effect, maybe have the Allies turn Murmansk over to Finland to further isolate the Soviets).

The Union of Russian Soviets, the Ukraine, and the Tsarist Russian Empire which has a capitol in Yekaterinburg and controls the Don-Kuban Valley (Cossacks), the Urals, and Siberia, as well as Central Asia. Japan wanted to hold Siberia and backed down when threatened by the USA, CSA, and Britain.

Also, with no Soviet Union, the Mongolians get no support for the independence of Outer Mongolia, but they still manage independence with the Chinese Civil War flaring up.

With the Depression, and likely historical Japanese expansionism, there's the possibility that the Japanese will keep the USA out of their hair by getting the Western Alliance on their side. A similar thought probably crosses the mind of Der Fuehrer, who in this timeline likely considers the American Unions' entry into the Great War as the turning point, so the Western Alliance being courted by the Axis is possible.

Furthermore, the Soviets being drastically less powerful means no aid to Republican Spain from that quarter, while a conservative Russian Empire - also perhaps bordering on fascism but more of an archreactionary aristocratic ideology - may back the Nationalists to get rid of the Popular Front.

And no matter how distasteful they find Hitler, a Molotov-Ribbentrop-style pact dividing European Russia and Eastern Europe between Der Fuehrer and the Tsar is always possible.

All in all, instead of a three-alliance system like normal HOI2, it'd be Axis versus Allies.... but with the Axis more powerful due to having the Russian Empire, Texas, Spain, California, and Deseret as potential members. Alternatively, give the Russians the chance to outright join the Axis - as the Soviets get in their event for Molotov-Ribbentrop - and if they don't the possibility of Hitler driving East increases.

That is a good if exhausting suggestion, still I like it.

If the Central Powers fall before November 1917 I think that the Tsar may be doomed, but the Kerensky government may not be. After all the Communists made lots of gains by promising to end the war.

So give Russia a seriously unstable Republic marked with rapid economic growth, near famines, corruption, semi-autocratic rule, oppression of minorities, and the head of the Okhrana becoming President ;)

Before I forget, when should the blacks be empaciated in this timeline? I kinda think the UK if no one else would insist on it.

By the way Steve, how do you think it best to mimic the gentlemen's agreement in the game?

With increases of industrialization happening, and it not being "forced" by the US, the Confederacy would emancipate the slaves in their holdings somewhere by the turn of the century, perhaps 1890's or so, no later than the early part of the 1900-1910 decade. Since Emancipation will come from a "local" source (the Plantation owners and the South's capitol), the era of Carpet Bagging won't exsist (as badly) and, though Jim Crow will still have a impact.

If the Confederacy and the US both have trade agreements between them (even Gentlemen Agreeements), the plantation owners will still come to realize:

a) Machines can do the work much cheaper in the long run, than having to feed and clothe hundreds of slaves

b) Machines can do the work quicker....

Massive Plantation farms will eventually go the same route they did in the normal timeline - they will die out as the rich southern "gentleman" converts to machined labor.


My opinion, but since this is a alt-timeline, changes can be made at your leisure to suit the scenario.

I have thoughts of the CSA letting blacks serve as merc troops for the Euros in exchange for their freedom and their wives and children. I also figure the CSA would encourage them to move out of the CSA at that point.

The problem with emancipation with the CSA is that we presume its inevitability no matter what, but you have to deal with the fact that the very basis of the CSA, ideologically, was to maintain Southern culture, on which chattel slavery of blacks was crucial (and in fact was enshrined in the CSA Constitution). Churchill's utopian vision of a triumphant Lee becoming CSA President and ending slavery on the power of his popularity is not quite realistic in that end.

What's more probable is that the CSA did so only under tremendous British pressure combined with economic reasons and the fact that the instant the British withdraw their friendship, the Union - which has likely successfully industrialized - will come for them. Texan secession might actually be prompted, partially, by opposition to the constitutional reforms to end slavery, and its independence better explained by the CSA having to suppress rebellions (likely cynically backed by the Union) against emancipation, likely by the Southern fireeaters and their successors, and the Texans well-placed to resist this. Another possibility is that since the Anglo-French rivalry still existed at the time, that plays a part in the larger issue of Maximillian in Mexico, gradual emancipation in the CSA (and possibly a Spartanesque policy of promising freedom to black slaves who serve in the army for so long, an emergency measure to restore the army to the necessary level to deal with security threats), and Texan secession.

As for Utah and California, I'm not sure of a good POD alone to promote Mormon secession (or rather rebellion, as Utah didn't join the Union as a state until 1896), but as for Californian, just having it as "Federal bad conduct" likely won't work. What might be better is Californian animosity toward Union revanchism toward the first war and perhaps the Chinese immigration issue among others, prompting the core lands of California to secede and, with Texan backing, pulling Oregon with them.

Maybe, despite the Western Alliance, there should still be some "suspicion" between Texas, Deseret, and California, as they share long borders with each other and may have rival claims that they've not pressed due to a perceived need to "hang together or hang seperately". Not to mention the likely cultural differences.

I'm also not sure that Texas can so effectively conquer Mexico, unless they did it fairly recently (say during WWI) while the USA and CSA were busy in Europe, as too many countries would have a vested interest in maintaining Mexico in some form. The sheer fact that they have, and that California only has a few pieces of it (mostly Baja California and western Sonora), may serve for further strain in the Alliance.

I'm also pondering why the Western Alliance gets pulled into the Spanish-American War. Spain's not exactly a wealthy country at that point, and has little ability to "bribe" anyone. I understand you feel you need one to have American expansion into the Pacific, but there's little reason for the western states to join in.

What's more likely is that after the US gains Pacific holdings and the CSA gains Cuba, with inroads into Central America, the Westerners feel endangered and attempt a military solution, mostly in driving the US out of the Pacific. The USN wins against the Californian navy, however, ending the threat to Hawaii, and the Texan-Mormon offensive into Montana to cut the Trans-continental rail fails. The CSA sees a chance to reclaim territory from Texas (maybe Texas initially dragged the entire trans-Mississippi with them in secession, or at least chunks of Arkansas and Louisiana - also, it should've dragged Oklahoma along as well, Oklahoma was historically, as the Cherokee Indian Territory, on the CSA's side) and so they join the war on the side of the Union. The Texans are forced to evacuate their gains in Kansas and Colorado, the Union counterattacks push the Mormons back into southern Idaho and western Wyoming, and a Californian siege of Seattle is lifted (Replace that with the Oklahoma City siege you have in your TL).

The war ends in 1905 after a year or two, with all sides exhausted; it's the last war to see the use of effective horse-cavalry and showed dangerous hints of what was ahead for Europe, though the spaces were simply too wide to be anything like the Western Front. The Westerners sue for peace and the borders go toward those you've demonstrated, the Union and CSA both frustrated in some aims (Especially the Union, which only gains Oklahoma and the part of Colorado north of the Arkansas River (that is, the province of Denver that you have them holding). Also, maybe have Boise province (the northern-most Mormon province in Utah if I'm wrong about the name) as Union, with the Union forcing a new border with Deseret on the Snake River (which would make Boise part of the Union).

Ten years later, the US and CS enter WWI because Germany, unlike historical, sees no reason to stop unrestrained sub warfare since they think they can manipulate the West into joining the Central Powers. But that backfires between British threats - which would spell economic ruin - and a momentary breakdown in the Alliance's cohesion since all of the nations are now weighing the worth of the alliance (there may even be a movement in California to rejoin the Union). The West doesn't join, Germany loses, and the best chance of avenging the 1905 defeat passes.... for now.

Another note: Nevada was a state by 1863, and even if it turned against the Union when California did, there's absolutely no reason for it to be held by the Mormons. It should be part of California. Really, Deseret is a bit too large. It should also be very much the junior partner between Texas and California, who are the powers of the West; Deseret is just a weird cult's theocratic republic that occupies some okay land and which serves as a strategic buffer protecting the upper portion of the Colorado River. In fact, maybe have the 1905 peace lead to Deseret especially being reamed, losing Idaho north of the Snake River and all of Colorado.

And those are my thoughts for now.

Not to discount your suggestions Steve but I've already said the map is finial. I'm not changing around North America anymore, I'm tired of dicking around with North America. I'm willing to make some changes to the history to help explain that map better though and you've made some good ones.

As for the Cherokee being historically Confed... The answer is yes and no. Cherokee tribes in the Tennessee/Carolina's area fought damn hard fro the Confed and the Southern Tribes of the Cherokee were very pro Confederation. They were the main backers of Watie's coup. However John Ross and the legally elected council that General Watie couped had favored neutrality with some Union leanings. There's also the fact that Watie sided with Andrew fucking Jackson *spits* and sold out the rest of the tribe which did not help his popularity.

I give you the new Middle East.

A few changes in Eastern Europe.



A new day in Central Asia.

Now I just need events.