LibriumArcana.Games

So, are Nit and I the only ones playing this game, since I've not seen anyone talking about it on here?

With the "Return to Ostagar" download now available for Origins, and DragonAge:Awakening due out this Spring, Nit and I are pretty excited.

It was fun, at times, painful at others. I didn't much care for the plot or the characters, but some of the side quests were engaging (like the Circle Tower quest line, clearing the Brecilian forest, and finding the urn of sacred ashes). I didn't much care for the main plot though, and while I found the setting to be mostly interesting, I didn't much care for the Grey Wardens either.

Some of the mechanics were skewy. Like how I could buy off my friends with gifts even after I did something they took a moral stance against: "What? You're helping people? That's insane and stupid and irresponsible and don't you know people should help themselves - OOH AHH LOOK A SHINY GIMME GIMME GIMME"

Is Return to Ostagar any good?

The main quest was too generic fantasy and the Grey Wardens as an organization inspired no affection in me, but the characters and the side quests (including the big recruit faction x quests) were good.

God I hate the Grey Wardens. "Drink this potion so you can join our order. If you don't, we'll kill you. If you do, it might still kill you. Oh, even if it works your life span will still be lower than it would have been if you hadn't. Did I mention how you really have no choice in this matter?"

Yeah, fuck you Duncan. I hope some darkspawn shit in your mouth.

Yeah, fuck you Duncan. I hope some darkspawn shit in your mouth.

But at least you're not bitter about it man.

That does seem a bit odd to be more serious here. I mean if these guys are suppose to be the defense against the Bug... *coughs* Darkspawn horde, having an joining rite that kills them seems self defeating. You think they would put some energy into finding something better.

In-universe, it's a desperate thing that's supposed to give them an edge (they can sense the proximity of Darkspawn, and it also seems to give them an affinity with what the demon lord is planning - at least, that's the impression I got). That said, the problem I have with it is that it forces me to become a Grey Warden in order to advance the plot.

Compare this to the more subtler Baldur's Gate origin, where you don't know who the mysterious masked stranger is who kills Gorion and threatens your life, and how you and he are tied together, and you spend the entire first game uncovering a mystery. Like Jules said, Dragon Age comes across as a LOTR knock off with sexy chicks being the only benefit it has over LOTR. I don't see the 'spiritual successor' to Baldur's Gate people claim it to be.

At the point the first Grey Wardens came about, the First Blight had been raging for over a hundred years. (read the codex) Tainting themselves was an act of desperation, and it let them kill the ArchDemon permanently. If you play the Sentry Peak download, there is a Grey Warden working on improving this plan. However, as with all choices, you have a choice whether to let him continue or not.


And that choice is the reason I like DragonAge so much. The game has a lot more choices where you can walk the line, where the "Greater Good" of destroying the Blight means sometimes the darker choices are going to get you further. You dont' have to be Lightside or DarkSide... you can walk the Grey Path and still get your goals done... although you might leave more bodies in your wake.

Frankly, it was a depth to the moral and social choices that sold me. It isn't '+5 Shiny Goodguy points' or 'As you boss people around, your eyes glow RED!' extremes. And there's legitimate reasons to play non-extremes. Money is scarce outside a few exploits. The 'evil path' magic is legitimately 'Ruin everyone's day', which makes for interesting times as your main healer is one who doesn't approve. And then there's the fun of betraying group A to summon a different army(golems, templars, werewolves. Sadly, I can't see a way to recruit the Disciples Of Andraste or any of their pain-bringing brood.).

Really the Grey Wardens make no sense until the big reveal near the end that the arch-demons just reincarnate into the nearest Darkspawn body if killed, but if they're killed by a Darkspawn tainted Grey Warden their corrupt soul is sucked into the Grey Warden and they both die. Up unitl then I was going "why the fuck do they bother with this self destructive shit?" When I learned the last bit it was "damn, that's fucking hard core. Sucks to be me, but at least it makes sense."

Dragon age was a good game, but not, in the final analysis, a great one.

The characters were fun, even though they were fairly generic archetypes. Despite being a bit bland, I found I actually liked Alistair. Sten was great fun and awesome to boot. Zevran and Oghren were horrible fantasy stereotypes (drunken dwarf? Really?) but their writing elevated them above their material (particularly Zevran's).

The voice acting was uniformly superb, I thought, which elevated the characters above their stereotypical roles. Special awards went (in my mind) to the excellent work for Teryn Loghain (when his voice actor re-appeared in Mass Effect 2, I did a literal spit-take), as well as for Flemeth (Captain Janeway as a witch!), and several others.

The story was horribly generic, I have to admit, but even within it there were individual "scenes" that I thought were superb. The Mage's opening story ended on what I thought was a nice little twist, when the friend you're helping escape is revealed to actually be the blood mage monster the authoritarian bad guys were searching for, and the bad guys prove (frankly) more than reasonable in the aftermath. Despite the logical absurdities of the Grey Warden state of affairs, I thought the actual scene wherein you become a warden was very well done indeed, impressing quite suddenly the ruthless nature of the organization you're joining up with. I thought the Dwarven political machinations were well done, and I liked the escapades in the Brecillian Forest, while the episode at Redcliffe castle had a very creepy and demented feel to it that were well done. Finally, there were some moments of what I thought were drop dead hilarity. I played the entire "Jailbreak" sequence over at least a dozen times just to see what the various combinations of characters would result in. Some of the lines in that sequence were literally laugh out loud funny.

The gameplay was... sub-par. I don't play Bioware games in search of deep gameplay, I grant, but Dragon Age was not even up to their usual par. The enemy AI was terrible, the encounters bland, with the exception of a handful of boss-style encounters. The inventory system was a pain in the ass, the equipment boring. The quest design varied from the inspired to the unforgivably monotonous (Fetch quests are bad enough, collection quests are not acceptable this side of an MMO). The game felt padded, badly, despite the fact that it was already of reasonable length. Many of the combat zones were simply way too large (the dwarven zones come to mind), and the fights were not about challenge, but about endurance. Party AI was cumbersome and annoying, requiring heavy micromanagement. Even your own character reacted poorly, I felt.

Overall, Dragon Age gets a B from me.

I largely agree with Havoc. My main source of complaint is I'm not too impressed with the 'mindless horde as villains' stereotype in a lot of generic fantasy. The darkspawn don't impress me as the main villains, and they're lead by a dragon... who in this setting aren't intelligent just really smart animals.

What happened to having a villain you could interact with? Teryn Logain and Teryn Howe kinda count, but not really for the principal villains. I hope that this oversight is corrected for the expansion pack.

I don't agree about the gameplay though. Bioware consistently makes games with excellent gameplay. Calling it sub-par isn't very fair. I wasn't expecting normal to be so difficult, but that's part of the challenge.

Loghain's voice actor is Simon Templeman, a guy whose work I've loved since I heard him in the Legacy of Kain games.

Arl/Teryn Howe was Tim Curry, btw.
Claudia Black was Morrigan.

Alistair I found very sweet, silly, and far too many scenes I was laughing aloud because IT WAS NITRAM.
Seriously, Alistair's reactions to my female elf were sooo Nitram I was staring at Nit and giggling as he shook his head in amaze.

There was some awesome interaction between Alistaer and Morrigan after my character slept with her. After bringing it and some indirect commentary Alistear ends up saying something along the lines of "just keep your distance from me. I don't want you to sucking my blood."

Morrigan: "If I get the desire to suck on anything of yours, I'll let you know."

Cynical Cat wrote:There was some awesome interaction between Alistaer and Morrigan after my character slept with her. After bringing it and some indirect commentary Alistear ends up saying something along the lines of "just keep your distance from me. I don't want you to sucking my blood."

Morrigan: "If I get the desire to suck on anything of yours, I'll let you know."

I heard that one while Nit was playing, and I damn near fell out of my chair laughing.

LadyTevar wrote:Arl/Teryn Howe was Tim Curry, btw.
Claudia Black was Morrigan.

Alistair I found very sweet, silly, and far too many scenes I was laughing aloud because IT WAS NITRAM.
Seriously, Alistair's reactions to my female elf were sooo Nitram I was staring at Nit and giggling as he shook his head in amaze.

I am considering cross gaming just so I can fuck his brains out.

Comrade Tortoise wrote:I am considering cross gaming just so I can fuck his brains out.

He takes a bit of wooing, giving him the Special Gifts like the amulet, but when Alistair decides to take you to bed, it's very romantic scene.


i'm thinking of running the Dwarven Noble next (female), and getting Zevren and Lelianna in bed
I also want to see what my Dear Brother Bhelan has to say about my reappearance. Metagaming, I know he's the best bastard for the job, but that don't mean I'll make it easy on him.

LadyTevar wrote:

Comrade Tortoise wrote:I am considering cross gaming just so I can fuck his brains out.

He takes a bit of wooing, giving him the Special Gifts like the amulet, but when Alistair decides to take you to bed, it's very romantic scene.


i'm thinking of running the Dwarven Noble next (female), and getting Zevren and Lelianna in bed
I also want to see what my Dear Brother Bhelan has to say about my reappearance. Metagaming, I know he's the best bastard for the job, but that don't mean I'll make it easy on him.

I had him at +80 or so when I ended the first time through...

Comrade Tortoise wrote:
I am considering cross gaming just so I can fuck his brains out.

There's probably a mod that allows a gay romance with Alistaer.

Cynical Cat wrote:

Comrade Tortoise wrote:
I am considering cross gaming just so I can fuck his brains out.

There's probably a mod that allows a gay romance with Alistaer.

To quote Nitram: "Dammit, I wish we had the PC version now... that would be too funny NOT to do!"

BTW: I'm still waiting for PS3 to put out Ostagar.