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LUXEMBOURG (AFP) - The
European Union has admitted that its nuclear talks with
Iran have run into a dead end and that it has been left with "no choice" but to return the matter to the UN Security Council.
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In a text adopted in Luxembourg Tuesday, EU foreign ministers expressed deep concern that Iran had not suspended uranium enrichment -- a process for fuelling a nuclear reactor but which could also be used to make an atomic bomb.

Major world powers have been debating whether to sanction Iran for ignoring an August 31 UN deadline to suspend the process, and preparations have been building for action at the Security Council.

"The council (of EU ministers) believed that Iran's continuation of enrichment related activities has left the EU no choice but to support consultations on such measures," they said in conclusions from their talks.

They "expressed deep concern that Iran has not yet suspended its enrichment-related and reprocessing activities as required" by the
International Atomic Energy Agency and the Security Council.

However the EU left open its door for further diplomacy.

"It reaffirmed its commitment to a negotiated solution, and that such a solution would contribute to the development of the EU's relations with Iran. It urged Iran to take the positive path on offer," the conclusions said.

EU foreign policy chief Javier Solana has been leading months of talks to convince the Islamic republic to start negotiations on suspending enrichment in exchange for a package of political and economic incentives.

"Iran refused everything," French Foreign Minister Philippe Douste-Blazy told journalists. "So we are returning to the Security Council to find measures that can be phased in but which are reversible."

He said that would allow a return to diplomacy if Iran was ready for it.

For now that appears unlikely. Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad reaffirmed last week that his government would not back down.

"We have decided to firmly insist on the Iranian nation's right and move forward, step by step, with wisdom, calm, contemplation and patience," he said, adding that "Iran is ready to negotiate under a scientific, legal and reasonable framework."

Solana, for his part, said he remained hopeful that talks with Iran could resume despite the move back to the Security Council, and that he had held telephone talks Monday with top Iranian nuclear negotiator Ali Larijani.

"It's up to the Security Council members to decide, but we want to keep the door open (to negotiations) as long as possible," he said.

But "it's up to Tehran to accept the conditions to start serious negotiations," said Solana, who tried in vain during for three months to convince the Iranians to stop uranium enrichment activities.

Finland, which currently holds the EU's rotating presidency, said the nature of any future sanctions had not been discussed at the talks in Luxembourg.

So far China and Russia, which both wield veto power on the Security Council, have balked at imposing the kind of punitive measures sought by the United States, with the backing of Britain

frigidmagi wrote:Okay, we did the talky thing. Well the Euros did the talky thing, but they're good at it. Now no one can say that negoation wasn't tried, and tried and tried again. Now what?

Petrosjko wrote:Nuclear war, eventually. The genie is pretty much out of the bottle these days. The real question is going to be as to whether the damage is reasonably localized or we get the 'if one flies, they all fly' scenario.

Stofsk wrote:Yes, he can joke!

Petrosjko wrote:

Stofsk wrote:Yes, he can joke!

I knew you had it in you!

frigidmagi wrote:[French mode]A strongly worded letter! Surely the situation is not so serious as to push us that far![/French mode]

Maybe I can hope the assholes in Tehran get a papercut or something from it...

Petrosjko wrote:One problem. The other is that the whole 'imminent collapse of Iran' scenario has been touted for a while now, and hasn't happened.

So I'll believe it when I see it.

Petrosjko wrote:One problem. The other is that the whole 'imminent collapse of Iran' scenario has been touted for a while now, and hasn't happened.

So I'll believe it when I see it.

SirNitram wrote:Birthrate is something like 1.6 and still falling. The economy is state run and all losing money. Something like 80% of the population wants something done about the economy, not nuclear weapons.

Of course, it's easy to be a dismissive idiot than to look up facts.

You want the reason it's holding together now? You want the dark little truth not American analyst will admit because he'd be fired so fast his fucking head would spin like the guy in the Exorcist?

As long as you have fear of outsiders, you can keep going for a while. And the US has been rattling the sabre.. Just as it was supposed to. The US is dancing to Iran's tune, and as long as it does, Iran will persist, because it gets the influence, prestige, and stability of being America's 'Great Enemy'.

Petrosjko wrote:

SirNitram wrote:Birthrate is something like 1.6 and still falling. The economy is state run and all losing money. Something like 80% of the population wants something done about the economy, not nuclear weapons.

Previously, it was the fact that they've had to import foreign mercenaries for crowd control for some time now, among other factors such as the low birthrate and abysmal economy.

North Korea has been a shithole for decades. Tianamen, at the time, was considered a potential ignition point for nationwide revolution or at least large-scale changes in China. These sort of countries can totter along a great while on what literally amounts to murderous inertia.

Of course, it's easy to be a dismissive idiot than to look up facts.

Also easy to assume that the guy you're talking to doesn't have an acquaintance with the issue, boyo.

You want the reason it's holding together now? You want the dark little truth not American analyst will admit because he'd be fired so fast his fucking head would spin like the guy in the Exorcist?

As long as you have fear of outsiders, you can keep going for a while. And the US has been rattling the sabre.. Just as it was supposed to. The US is dancing to Iran's tune, and as long as it does, Iran will persist, because it gets the influence, prestige, and stability of being America's 'Great Enemy'.

No shit. And if it wasn't us, it'd be somebody else. Despotic regimes always thrive on external threats. We obligingly fill the role, but even if there weren't real threats in the area, they'd manufacture them.

SirNitram wrote:And? What's the damn point? Hasn't happened yet, so blow it off? Ah, a brilliant plan. Same as why it was safe to dismiss the idea the USSR wouldn't last, because it had lasted until WW2.

Yes, they can. However, I've yet to see any evidence that Iran will be able to sustain the same as North Korea. Perhaps you could provide some, since this is part of your claims.

Sorry, kid. You need to provide more than 'Well, it's been said before' to actually rebutt them.

And yet, they've grown in international prestige, which grants them more foreign mercs,

which grants them more opportunities for internal holding it down, since they had a real threat.

Because a manufactured threat isn't as good as the real deal.

Petrosjko wrote:

SirNitram wrote:And? What's the damn point? Hasn't happened yet, so blow it off? Ah, a brilliant plan. Same as why it was safe to dismiss the idea the USSR wouldn't last, because it had lasted until WW2.

Never said it wouldn't happen. I'd love to see it happen, but I'm not buying into the doomsday scenarios until they actually start to come to fruition.

SirNitram wrote:In case you didn't bother to read, I said they were hurting from one nation's sanctions, and that if you lumped on more.. Taking action as opposed to sitting upon one's ass.. It would worsen catastrophically. You have yet to provide jack or shit to rebutt this, just gone on with 'Heard it before' and pretend that's a rebuttal.

Petrosjko wrote:

SirNitram wrote:In case you didn't bother to read, I said they were hurting from one nation's sanctions, and that if you lumped on more.. Taking action as opposed to sitting upon one's ass.. It would worsen catastrophically. You have yet to provide jack or shit to rebutt this, just gone on with 'Heard it before' and pretend that's a rebuttal.

Because 'I've heard it before' and 'I'll believe it when I see it' were exactly my point. Assuming that further sanctions were to make it through, we have a lot of counterexamples where externally-induced economic collapses have failed to induce regime change, such as right the fuck next door or in North Korea.

To be very clear- I'm all for full sanctions. Right now, it's the best course we've got absent a large-scale bombing campaign or turning the sand into glass, which is obviously out the window unless they initiate the conflict.

But I'm not pinning my hopes on bringing the regime down this way, in part because of the very factor you've mentioned- it'll give them more in the way of Great Satan to toss around internally when the food supply runs low and the medicinals fall out of stock.

By the way, LONG TIME NO SEE MARTIN, MISSED THE FUCK OUTTA YA. HOW'S TEV?

SirNitram wrote:Given that the present fear is that Iran will fund outside groups or produce nukes, Cuba is a good solution until a real plan for improving the situation can be enabled. Cuba is doing neither, you'll notice.

True, there is that. Which is why the US can't afford to keep playing by itself.

She's good, I'm good, neither of us have nearly died in months.

It's kinda depressing that's the measuring stick.

Petrosjko wrote:Best of all, hopefully they buy their schematics from Khan.

Edit- I speel gud.

Best of all, hopefully they buy their schematics from Khan