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#1 No buyer for voting machine unit
Posted: Thu Aug 16, 2007 1:23 pm
by frigidmagi
BBC
US cash dispenser and security company Diebold has admitted that it has failed to find a buyer for its troubled electronic voting machine business.
Diebold and other manufacturers of such voting machines have been hit by criticism that they are unreliable and vulnerable to tampering.
Growing unease about the machines in the US has led to a number of delayed orders from states.
Diebold said that as a result, its 2007 revenues would fall $120m (£61m).
It added that it would now allow the unit to operate more independently, with a separate board of directors and, possibly, a new management structure.
Possible future sale
Diebold said it had not ruled out another attempt at a full or partial sale.
Some 50 million Americans, about 30% of registered voters, used electronic machines to cast their vote in the 2004 presidential election.
The machines were introduced in the aftermath of the problems caused by antiquated punch-card systems in the 2000 presidential election.
However, there has since been growing concern that electronic machines may be equally as unreliable.
I'm pretty happy about this. Course keep in mind I think voting should be done completely on paper and you should have to show photo I.D to vote. I've also been called a bastard for saying we should ensure only citizens vote.
#2
Posted: Thu Aug 16, 2007 2:07 pm
by Cpl Kendall
I've never understood the US system. In Canada you go into the booth, mark an X next to the canidate/party you wish to vote for with a pencil and your done. Total time taken: 30 seconds. And we've yet to have a clusterfuck like the Florida recount fiasco in 2000. I don't understand why the US can't do that. Surely the average citizen can handle it.
#3
Posted: Thu Aug 16, 2007 3:40 pm
by LadyTevar
We had the "PunchCard" voting system. Take an actual punchcard into the booth with you, and slide it down into the slot. (1) Next, turn the booklet affixed to the table to the right page, and follow the instructions. (2) To make our selection, use the small awl to punch a hole next to your choice, as marked by the arrow. This marks the punchcard on a certain number. (3)
(1) Card may not be all the way in the slot, or otherwise inserted improperly.
(2) If lined up right, the columns of the card line up with the opening on the booklet's spine.
(3) This is where the problem was, from what I understand. There is a bit of resistance before the awl goes through the punchcard. On our ballots, the awl may not punch through all the way, or may feel like it did and didn't. From what I understand, the cards in Florida were embossed so the awl didn't need much pressure to go through. With the ballet printed in what some said was a confusing manner, some of the seniors started to punch one, then moved to their true choice. Those half-punches left behind the 'hanging chad'.
#4
Posted: Thu Aug 16, 2007 4:44 pm
by frigidmagi
My states (Oklahoma and Arizona) use paper and pencil/pen. Course some states want to be all digital.
#5
Posted: Fri Aug 17, 2007 6:49 am
by Mayabird
Georgia's in the all-digital category, as far as I can tell (I've only voted in Atlanta) and there have been huge problems with it. The security on them, digital and physical, is atrocious. At one point after voting was done a huge pile of the voting machines was left unattended in a public area of the GT student center. It would have been trivial for anyone to walk right up, get in the system, and start switching votes around. I wouldn't be surprised if someone tried. The reaction in the general public? Meh. Nobody cares. With a couple computer nerds you could steal an election here easily and nobody would notice or give a damn. Oh yeah, and those were Diebold, too. The old machines will probably be in use for the next twenty years or so. You know how these things go.
It occurs to me that the only thing protecting the state of Georgia from this is the supreme idiocy of the Georgians in it. Even the politicians are too dumb to think of it.
#6
Posted: Fri Aug 17, 2007 8:54 am
by Kreshna Aryaguna Nurzaman
At one point after voting was done a huge pile of the voting machines was left unattended in a public area of the GT student center. It would have been trivial for anyone to walk right up, get in the system, and start switching votes around.
Computer system is only as good as people who design it. Frankly, a voting machine designed with such user-friendly GUI interface (I presume) that anyone can just get in the system and start switching votes around is fundamentally flawed.
It's not really that difficult to set the database, for instance, to only enable INSERT operation for the front end app (where voters submitted their vote) while completely disable the UPDATE operation or limit it to a very restrictive usergroup. Hell, they can also make the system in such way that nobody can perform database updates through the front end application.
But even those are not enough; there are still security policy issues to care about. Hell, I've seen organizations where EVERY SINGLE USER (including operators) logs in to the database with the goddamn
sys/oracle as sysdba account. And no, I'm not kidding ya.
#7
Posted: Fri Aug 17, 2007 11:47 am
by SirNitram
Diebold's voting machines are designed to fail. I'm sorry, but that's the only conclusion possible. Their ATM's aren't this shoddily built. They can't be hacked with a few minutes unsurpervised in a booth(Feign difficulty and you're in!). Their code was never leaked to the web.
So what has Diebold done? Renamed it's voting machine's unit(It's now 'Premiere', not 'Diebold'.), and started scrubbing Wikis of criticism of itself.
#8
Posted: Sat Aug 18, 2007 12:49 am
by Kreshna Aryaguna Nurzaman
SirNitram wrote:Diebold's voting machines are designed to fail. I'm sorry, but that's the only conclusion possible.
That's what I've been thinking too. I've never even seen the voting machines myself, but the way it is described, it seems that even Yahoo mail is still more secure.
The question is why? Why anyone would even bother to create such flawed machine on the first place?
#9
Posted: Sat Aug 18, 2007 9:06 am
by Cpl Kendall
Kreshna Aryaguna Nurzaman wrote:
That's what I've been thinking too. I've never even seen the voting machines myself, but the way it is described, it seems that even Yahoo mail is still more secure.
The question is why? Why anyone would even bother to create such flawed machine on the first place?
This may shound like a wacko theory: but maybe they want the Republicans to win.
#10
Posted: Sat Aug 18, 2007 10:14 am
by LadyTevar
Cpl Kendall wrote:Kreshna Aryaguna Nurzaman wrote:
That's what I've been thinking too. I've never even seen the voting machines myself, but the way it is described, it seems that even Yahoo mail is still more secure.
The question is why? Why anyone would even bother to create such flawed machine on the first place?
This may shound like a wacko theory: but maybe they want the Republicans to win.
Considering they make Large Donations to the Republican Party? Yeah, that's the current theory.
#11
Posted: Sat Aug 18, 2007 10:18 am
by Cpl Kendall
LadyTevar wrote:
Considering they make Large Donations to the Republican Party? Yeah, that's the current theory.
Ha! My tinfoil hat doesn't look so stupid afterall.
#12
Posted: Sat Aug 18, 2007 1:00 pm
by SirNitram
Kreshna Aryaguna Nurzaman wrote:SirNitram wrote:Diebold's voting machines are designed to fail. I'm sorry, but that's the only conclusion possible.
That's what I've been thinking too. I've never even seen the voting machines myself, but the way it is described, it seems that even Yahoo mail is still more secure.
The question is why? Why anyone would even bother to create such flawed machine on the first place?
I believe the owner came out and announced that when he said he promised to deliver Ohio to Bush.
But if you actually look at facts like that, you're apparently a whacko.
#13
Posted: Sun Aug 19, 2007 6:22 am
by Kreshna Aryaguna Nurzaman
SirNitram wrote:I believe the owner came out and announced that when he said he promised to deliver Ohio to Bush.
But if you actually look at facts like that, you're apparently a whacko.
I understand why you've been cynical about this, Nit. There are just too many facts that nobody should easily dismiss the theory as 'whacko'. I've been reading the case again.... From the letter from Diebold's CEO to the Ohio Republicans to the lame 'faulty memory chip' excuse.
By the way, faulty memory chip does NOT cause the data to be magically altered. Damn. Here in Indonesia, we have an idiot public figure named Roy Suryo who loves spewing out IT-related bullshits that may impress general public but make the computer literates laugh. However,
even he is still above making statements like 'faulty memory chip causes the data to be altered'.