Building an enormous robot to guard your border...

dragonfolder · Post by **dragonfolder** » Wed Dec 16, 2009 2:39 pm

Hi all,

I got this idea: What if the world was a place with shifting borders e.g. reality is warped outside the "stable" zones, and a race (whatever they be) used enormous robots/golems as borderposts - both to safeguard and to function as reality-stabilizers. (Got some of the inspiration from the Darksteel Colossus - Just pay attention to the picture)

The thing I'd like some input on is the logistics behind having such huge devices and the implications they would have. E.g. self-powered/need external power supply, tech needed to produce such items, etc... Also I'm not sure what the social implications of having such monsters around. It's like having nuclear reactor with missiles integrated around your border ^^

All thoughts appreciated as this is one bit I'm hoping to use in a sci-fi magitech setting under development. [/url]

fgalkin · Post by **fgalkin** » Wed Dec 16, 2009 3:44 pm

Why are they robots as opposed to towers on treads? To make life harder for their makers? Why do they need to move at all?

Have a very nice day.
-fgalkin

dragonfolder · Post by **dragonfolder** » Wed Dec 16, 2009 4:05 pm

well, part of the reason the have to be able to move is because as they function as the border, their creators want to have an expanding border with low upkeep. Use lots of reasouces to build one of these things and you have a safe border which you can slowly expand.

I've got this image of miles and miles to desolate plains with the huge "golem" being the only thing which breaks the horizon. All of a sudden something huge warped and distortes reality. Shifting and fading, all you can see is an indistict blurr the size of a stadium. This is what the robots guard against. (love the idea of a big golem battling equally big foes ^^)

A huge mobile golem can cover a larger area than a tower on threads, and therefore you can space the golems further apart. Going with your idea I can image huge towers patrolling a given area or having an ever expanding wall where all the towers are within a gunshot.

(Still very much in working progress, the alien from outer reality could just as well be a huge behemoth, etc... Huge foes call for drastic measures)

- Any idea of what would be a viable powersource, for either golem/tower? Thinking nuclear (fusion/fission) - might function with fusion based on water (draw moisture from the air?) or have a base stock with radioactive materials. I'm not too stable on weird power sources unfortunately. I'd like some sort of "everlasting" powersource, or at least something which can keep it going for millenia. (sticking with the image of a huge eternal sentinal forever watching, and ever vigil).

- Hope that clarified somewhat. (I do ramble on sometimes

)

frigidmagi · Post by **frigidmagi** » Wed Dec 16, 2009 4:05 pm

First off Magitech of any kind belongs in fantasy.

Alright to decide what you deploy you need to know what you're deploying against. So Folder may I ask, what are they guarding the border from?

Also why one giant robot? Is the border just that small?

dragonfolder · Post by **dragonfolder** » Wed Dec 16, 2009 4:15 pm

My bad ^^, I'll try to rewind.

1) The border is big: A sircle rougly the size of Europe. The robots are spaced as evenly as they can be on the outer border in order to stabilize reality. Due to outside threats few if any live close to the outer border, hence the image of a lone watchfull robot.

2) Not quite sure what I will have as an outside threat. I'm basing this on a campaign idea where five realms based on metal, wood, fire, water and earth are in constant flux. The robots are part of the realm of metal. Ideas might be enormous animals, moving mountains (think norwegian trolls) and huge sea serpants.

3) Outside the borders everything is shifting. The ground you thread might soon become water - only to turn into a vast forest. when the borders are for the lack of a better term "destabilized" anything might come through, and the robot might suddenly be fighting knee deep in a big lake versus a river dragon.

Does that answer you questions?

fgalkin · Post by **fgalkin** » Wed Dec 16, 2009 4:22 pm

dragonfolder wrote:well, part of the reason the have to be able to move is because as they function as the border, their creators want to have an expanding border with low upkeep. Use lots of reasouces to build one of these things and you have a safe border which you can slowly expand.

Or, you could put 10 smaller cheaper ones for the same cost, that will cover twice the space with a greater stabilization effect so that less things warp in. (What sort of things? You make the threat, then the response to it, not the other way around!)

I've got this image of miles and miles to desolate plains with the huge "golem" being the only thing which breaks the horizon. All of a sudden something huge warped and distortes reality. Shifting and fading, all you can see is an indistict blurr the size of a stadium. This is what the robots guard against. (love the idea of a big golem battling equally big foes ^^)

What happens if the Thing messes up the Golem's leg joints and another one warps in a few dozen kilometers to the side? Oh, and desolate plains is perfect tread country.

A huge mobile golem can cover a larger area than a tower on threads, and therefore you can space the golems further apart.

What makes you say that?

Going with your idea I can image huge towers patrolling a given area or having an ever expanding wall where all the towers are within a gunshot.

Yup, and as more and more towers are added, the border is pushed further and further out.

(Still very much in working progress, the alien from outer reality could just as well be a huge behemoth, etc... Huge foes call for drastic measures)

Once again, you need to work on the threat before you make the response.

Have a very nice day.
-fgalkin

dragonfolder · Post by **dragonfolder** » Wed Dec 16, 2009 4:32 pm

I've to say thank you fgalkin for your insightful replies

.

I'll get back to you when I've fleshed out the setting a bit more and worked out what sort of threats there are if that's ok with you.

Have nice day you too.

Batman · Post by **Batman** » Wed Dec 16, 2009 5:41 pm

For 'eternal' power source I'm afraid fusion AND fission are right out, at least if you want to them to work like the real thing. Fission piles CAN'T be made arbitrarily large (that pesky critical mass thing) and fusion requires a continuous input of fuel. And no, I don't think you can draw any meaningful amounts of hydrogen from the surrounding air. If you DON'T want your border guards to run on technobabble/magic (like a ZPM, the Allspark, hyperspace tap etc) your best bet is either a remote energy feed OR them actually requiring refueling every once in a while.

rhoenix · Post by **rhoenix** » Wed Dec 16, 2009 5:44 pm

Using a black hole with about the mass of 100 million tons should work for about 100 years; that size is more or less the sweet spot as far as the amount of Hawking radiation produced versus lifespan.

Batman · Post by **Batman** » Wed Dec 16, 2009 6:05 pm

Unless we're talking about a REALLY REALLY REALLY REALLY REALLY big Golem I think a Black Hole is a bit overboard. And unless we're AGAIN talking about a REALLY REALLY REALLY REALLY REALLY big Golem that's going to be a 100 million ton point gravity source. I suspect there's going to be side effects.

rhoenix · Post by **rhoenix** » Wed Dec 16, 2009 6:09 pm

Batman wrote:Unless we're talking about a REALLY REALLY REALLY REALLY REALLY big Golem I think a Black Hole is a bit overboard. And unless we're AGAIN talking about a REALLY REALLY REALLY REALLY REALLY big Golem that's going to be a 100 million ton point gravity source. I suspect there's going to be side effects.

It would be about the size of your fist, dude. The only fun part would be containment.

Batman · Post by **Batman** » Wed Dec 16, 2009 6:45 pm

Windswept wrote: It would be about the size of your fist, dude. The only fun part would be containment.

That was sort of my point.

fgalkin · Post by **fgalkin** » Wed Dec 16, 2009 7:18 pm

dragonfolder wrote:I've to say thank you fgalkin for your insightful replies .

I'll get back to you when I've fleshed out the setting a bit more and worked out what sort of threats there are if that's ok with you.

Have nice day you too.

While you're at it, please work out how exactly this "reality stabilizers" thing works. You have an expanding border, but what about deep inside it where the people live? Do you have Things appearing there? If not, why? What about above and below the surface of the planet? Do you have Things dropping in from above or burrowing in from below? Trying to destroy the planet from within? What is the effect of "reality warp" on unstabilized reality anyway? What is outside the borders?

There is a lot of fundamental things you need to work out before you get to the details like power generation of the units, and in doing so, open up opportunities. Maybe your units run on Warped Coal or something.

Have a very nice day.
-fgalkin

rhoenix · Post by **rhoenix** » Wed Dec 16, 2009 7:42 pm

Batman wrote:That was sort of my point.

I sure as hell wouldn't try to shoot at one if the black hole powering it were to lose containment if I did. That might end up redecorating the countryside a little bit.

fgalkin · Post by **fgalkin** » Wed Dec 16, 2009 7:46 pm

That depends on what's shooting at it. Maybe it'll decide that it tickles but is kinda pleasant. Of course, having a black hole powering the machine will probably cause it to fall through the earth, or warp the planet around it, depending on how massive it is, so it wouldn't exactly be my first choice.

Have a very nice day.
-fgalkin

Batman · Post by **Batman** » Wed Dec 16, 2009 8:04 pm

Windswept wrote:
Batman wrote:That was sort of my point.
I sure as hell wouldn't try to shoot at one if the black hole powering it were to lose containment if I did. That might end up redecorating the countryside a little bit.

I suspect there's going to be side effects.

Again, that was sort of my point.

SirNitram · Post by **SirNitram** » Thu Dec 17, 2009 12:07 am

Remove the mobile requirement, make the robot long stretches of autonomous wall with full sensor suites, equipped with low-cost weapons suitable for engaging most common targets. Give it a multiply redundant communications link to other wall segments, and to the authorities. Setup an autonomous railroad system, underground, delivering fresh fuel regularly.

There, I just simplified it so that it's cheaper to keep fabricating identical wall segments, rails, and expanding than to build some dumb mecha.

If you insist on mobile, one Mk XXX Bolo.

LibriumArcana.Games

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