Mad Renaissance STGOD

[Comrade Tortoise]

Game Thread is Up.

Attached are the Province Specific Bonuses to Resources and Economy, please note, there are three sheets within this file. These bonuses are all additive.

[frigidmagi]

Lys, Derek, Simon if you're playing we need your OOB guys.

[Charon]

Hey CT. Some of us would like to know what season it is. ;)

[Comrade Tortoise]

Spring, April 26th, 1478

[Charon]

And the military of the mighty Ottoman Empire is up.

[Lys]

Apologies, aside from events that make my life look like a soap opera, I have been waylaid by an attempt at tinkering with unit stats because the current balance fills me with horror. There was also an attempt to make the artillery more varied an interesting, since about half the park is missing. Oh and the naval units, which are anachronistic coming and going (longboats, galleons). This may have been foiled by everyone buying up their militarise though, since I doubt anybody much relishes buying them a second time. Never enough time to do everything.

[frigidmagi]

Lys I appreciate your attempt to perfect the rule system and attend to short comings in the unit roster, but sometimes you take what you have and play the game. Not trying to be offense here, but in the past alot of our STGODs died stillborn because everyone spent so much time arguing the rule system.

I hope everything works out okay at home. I wouldn't worry about getting your military up as long as you can give us the bare stats of kingdom of the Most Catholic Monarch.

[Cavalier]

I concur with Lys that the balance established in the rules set may be imperfect, which is why I was pushing to test it before starting. Certainly the naval rules are extremely crude and more than a little anachronistic and definitely need a major overhaul and expansion. I also think starting may have been premature in so far as we have no agreed upon general history or even a full map of Europe including NPCs; and the NPC states may be subject to change without warning if someone new joins. I have been talking with Ben a lot about this, and will do so more in the near future so as to hopefully flesh those things out. If possible setting up an IRC chatroom or AIM chat for everyone to have direct input in this would be nice and might help speed things up.

[Charon]

You had an entire week warning that the game was going to be starting and you said nothing. Now it's too fucking late. We are not changing rules. Period. You had a week to bring up ANY of those complaints or concerns, and you didn't.

[Cavalier]

You had an entire week warning that the game was going to be starting and you said nothing. Now it's too fucking late. We are not changing rules. Period. You had a week to bring up ANY of those complaints or concerns, and you didn't.

Hey fucktard, we've been talking to Ben. I put together the goddamned Resources chart, and gave him a layout of the HRE, and have been responsible for almost all of the rules tweaks for unit balance. So how about you shut your ignorant piehole, alright?

[Charon]

Hey fucktard, we've been talking to Ben. I put together the goddamned Resources chart, and gave him a layout of the HRE, and have been responsible for almost all of the rules tweaks for unit balance. So how about you shut your ignorant piehole, alright?

I'm not going to bring up any of my complaints with the system of this game publicly until after the game starts and then call people ignorant for not magically knowing that I've been having private meetings with Ben.

Fixed that for ya.

I fail to see how the list of stuff you've done for the game has anything to do with my statement however. Would you like a shiny gold star for your accomplishments? You had a week to bring up these complaints to us, or to Ben, or to anyone at all. You didn't. Am I wrong in that statement? Or would you prefer to spout more bluster and cursing at me?

[Cavalier]

Hey fucktard, we've been talking to Ben. I put together the goddamned Resources chart, and gave him a layout of the HRE, and have been responsible for almost all of the rules tweaks for unit balance. So how about you shut your ignorant piehole, alright?

I'm not going to bring up any of my complaints with the system of this game publicly until after the game starts and then call people ignorant for not magically knowing that I've been having private meetings with Ben.

Fixed that for ya.

I fail to see how the list of stuff you've done for the game has anything to do with my statement however. Would you like a shiny gold star for your accomplishments? You had a week to bring up these complaints to us, or to Ben, or to anyone at all. You didn't. Am I wrong in that statement? Or would you prefer to spout more bluster and cursing at me?

I've contributed more to this game than anyone except Ben, so I'm not going to mince words with a pissant who responds to reasonable concerns with a self-important declaration (with what fucking authority) that "we are not changing rules. Period." Ben knows full well what my concerns are since I've talked about them with him at length almost every day, so you can just take your pathetic attempt to ingratiate yourself by playing the outraged lackey and fuck off.

[Charon]

I've contributed more to this game than anyone except Ben,

*hands you your gold star with sparkles on it*

so I'm not going to mince words with a pissant who responds to reasonable concerns with a self-important declaration (with what fucking authority) that "we are not changing rules. Period."

Aww, I tink I hurt his poor widdle feewings. He keeps throwing out such bile, and still doesn't realize I don't give a shit what he thinks of me. It's almost cute really.

Seriously though. I never said they weren't reasonable. They are. And under any other situation I would actually be clamoring for the additions and changes to be made (hence why you being all fire and brimstone is so hilarious to me). But the point is, A) You've had almost a month to voice any of these concerns. If you have, why aren't these rather legitimate problems fixed yet? Also if you have, and Ben shot you down, why are you bringing them up again? B) I have played in many STGODs here in LibArc and the simple fact is that the longer we hash out the rules the more likely it is the game will be a stillbirth. This goes doubly if the game starts and then we pull it back in for further adjustments. C) Magi said, essentially, the same thing that I did, but you aren't trying to jump down his throat and acting like the high and mighty King of France (to which I think he would take some offense) about it.

Ben knows full well what my concerns are since I've talked about them with him at length almost every day, so you can just take your pathetic attempt to ingratiate yourself by playing the outraged lackey and fuck off.

Wait... did you...

Oh man. That's the funniest shit I've read all week. You just made my night. He thinks I'm playing lackey and that I'm trying to ingratiate myself. Would someone explain to the newbie how I operate? I'm gonna be too busy laughing for the next hour.

[Simon_Jester]

Crazy explosions aside...

I'm sorry, this completely slipped my mind last night. I'll get at least a basic nation lineup to you later tonight- where I am (slightly greater Bohemia under the son of George of Podebrady), who's in charge, what my stats are, as much as I've got.

A military order of battle will take a little longer, because of the way I've been trying to do it- define what certain 'units' of my military look like, then figure out how many of those I can pay for, rather than arbitrarily buying X of this and Y of that and trying to hammer together a doctrine for it all. It's the same process I undertook for SDNW4, but it was easier to do for that game because there weren't so many options and I didn't have so many other worries...

[Cavalier]

Magi wasn't a disrespectful little shit and actually bothered to post a reason for his opinion. You just posted your little violent reactionary decree, belittling me and Lys while dropping an f-bomb along the way, and then had the gall to complain about me swearing in response.

[Comrade Tortoise]

*sighs and puts on Supermod Hat*

Everyone: Chill. If you want to kill eachother, do it with gloriously anachronistic armies.

I am open to minor rule tweaks, things that wont radically alter the way people have made decisions. Non-retroactively-applied cost changes, additions of unit formations, and little tweaks to rates of fire. I know I dont have half the artillery that existed. I also know I dont have half the ships that existed, and that I will need to modify the stats on the upper level ships. This wont affect costs, but will, for example, make things other than galleons worth having (either attack values are too low, or defense values are too high. I am leaning toward the later).

If you want something that is NOT in the rules... you can make it. That is the glory of my little game. Creativity and Invention are encouraged. As is embracing the inherent ridiculousness of the setting a little bit and having some fun with it. Anachronism is encouraged, and if someone wants to do something stark raving mad with longships, that is their bag. That is why I have them there.

If we have problems with unit balance other than that, that is what a GM is FOR. The rules are a guide, not a straightjacket. Lord knows I am insane enough to be deathly afraid of those.

Are we done?

[Lys]

Jesus Christ, what the hell? All I did was say that I was trying to tweak the rules and that the deadline caught up with me, then shit blows up. I didn't ask for this. ;.;

[Comrade Tortoise]

Jesus Christ, what the hell? All I did was say that I was trying to tweak the rules and that the deadline caught up with me, then shit blows up. I didn't ask for this. ;.;

It happens sometimes.

[Charon]

Jesus Christ, what the hell? All I did was say that I was trying to tweak the rules and that the deadline caught up with me, then shit blows up. I didn't ask for this. ;.;

Eh. It happens.

If ya want you can blame me. :) (WTF? We don't have a normal smile smiley?)

[Simon_Jester]

I think Cavalier has a point about it being a little premature to say "Everything is cast in concrete now." We can start writing stuff, sure, but hammering out a consensus history and making sure no one's likely to jump into the game from outside next week are worthwhile.

Which is, again, not to say we can't write stuff.

EDIT: OK, that's something up- my hat in the ring and now you know where I am. I'm sorry that there isn't more and that I'm having trouble making something gel enough for a story post- some ideas just occured to me but I'm too tired to put them together right now.

[Charon]

...

Fuck! I can't believe I forgot about Camalry! *plots*

[Comrade Tortoise]

Hey Simon, the equations are: 1+.5 economy etc. So it would come to (((5)*8)+((4.5)*3))*1000 =
53,500 florins/season

[Simon_Jester]

I think I must have misread the rules; could you go back and check that the formulas are written in an unambiguous way?

[Cavalier]

So yeah, that history I was talking about? Spent today working on getting it ready. Here is the draft, approved by Ben for posting. If those concerned have objections/additions/clarifications to add, do so here. A timeline for Italy has also been worked on and may be posted later. I will attempt to put another one up for Central Europe and Ben has been working on one for England and France.

Church History Highlights
1378: Western Schism. Countries largely recognize pontiffs based on political factors. France, which dominates the Avignon Papacy, leads the opposition to the Roman pontiff. Castile, Aragon, Scotland, and Naples swiftly follow the French lead. The rest of Italy defaults to the native pope Urban VI, as does England, Poland, Hungary, and Scandinavia. Portugal and Sicily vary allegiance based on political opportunity, and the Holy Roman Empire fails to take a consistent approach.

1380: The Avignon Pope, Clement VII, commissions Louis d'Anjou to take Rome on his behalf. The hand of the French King Charles V is behind the engagement, and the French treasury provides support for the expedition.

1381: Pope Urban VI flees Rome rather than lead the defenses of the city. The Romans fight off the overstretched, malaria-ridden mercenary army's effort to take the city by coup de main. A desultory siege ends after Louis runs out of money and is forced to withdraw back to France.

1384: Naples is conquered by the combined forces of Charles of Anjou and Rome.

1389: On the death of Urban VI, the Roman mob overturns the original selection of his Cardinals of a Neapolitan nobleman and forces the recognition of local prelate Giovanni Massimo as Pope. He takes the regnal name of Alexander V.

1392: Naples is annexed to the Roman state, ostensibly on the authority of the new Pope Alexander for promoting Schism. The shift in the balance of power causes a reaction as much of northern Italy, including Milan, Florence, and Venice, recognize Clement VII.

1394: Death of Clement VII, and election of Pedro de Luna as Benedict XIII at Avignon. The first calls come from the Sorbonne in favor of a Council to resolve the disputed succession.

1400: Attempts by Charles VI of France to organize an ecclesiastical council encourage French neutrality in northern Italy. Though nothing comes of the attempt due to the obstinacy of Benedict XIII and the disinterest of the new Roman Republic in diluting their control over the papacy.

1409: France declares a policy of neutrality in the disputed succession and offers to host another council to resolve the dispute if both Benedict XIII and Alexander V resign. Neither pope bothers to respond to the call, but a number of cardinals and churchmen gather in Paris around the Sorbonne. The Council takes on a radical cast as the theological seminarians put reform of clerical discipline on the agenda. With the prestige of both the Avignon and Roman papacies collapsing, sentiment grows in favor of deposing both Popes.

1410: The Council of Paris passes a resolution asserting the superiority of ecclesiastical councils and deposing both Popes. Election of a new Pope proves almost impossible, leading to rioting that has to be suppressed by the King of France. Charles VI, horrified at the violence and seriously annoyed at the failure of the Council, orders it dispersed. A core membership moves to Strasbourg and continues deliberations, eventually electing Pierre d'Ailly as Pope John XXIII.

1411: Religious tumult and disturbances in Prague attract the attention of the competing Papacies. Left with a free hand for once, Alexander V responds by backing King Sigismund of Hungary to the hilt. Pope Benedict XIII in turn used the turmoil and heresy as a sign of the bankruptcy of the Romans and their allies. The Council of Strasbourg invites the leader of the Wycliffites, Jan Hus, to defend his views before them.

1412: Jan Hus attends the Council of Strasbourg. King Wenceslas of Bohemia, dominated by his brother Sigismund, declares him an outlaw. The Hussites in Bohemia are subjected to increasing restrictions and violence.

1414: The Council of Strasbourg issues a lengthy listing of reforms for clerical discipline. The resulting document was clearly influenced by Hus. Both Benedict and Alexander angrily denounce the Council as a tool of heretics, and of the other. Portions of the Holy Roman Empire accept the Council's rulings, and publications of its theological decrees and decisions circulate widely throughout Europe.

1415: Jan Hus is waylaid on his way back to Bohemia and murdered by knights loyal to Emperor Sigismund. The invasion of France by Henry V diverts the attention of Charles VII away from his efforts to resolve the Schism.

1416: Death of Alexander V. The Roman Cardinals elect Pietro Orsini his successor, as Boniface IX. Affected by the Strasbourg Council, he declares a program of clerical reform and attempts to crack down on simony. He is prevented from proposing a resignation of all three Popes and a new Council only by the direct intervention of Nicola Rienzi.

1419: Beginning of the Hussite Wars. Boniface IX is reluctant to condemn the Hussites and instead appeals for Sigismund and the followers of Hus to submit their differences to his judgement. Neither the Emperor nor the Hussites have any interest in this, but Benedict XIII is able to sway Sigismund with the promise of support for a Crusade.

1420: Death of John XXIII. At the request of Sigismund, his son-in-law Archduke Albert disperses the Strasbourg Council. The Holy Roman Empire recognizes the Avignon Papacy.

1423: Death of Benedict XIII. On his death Sanchez Munoz is elected as Clement VIII.

1429: Faced with the increasing disorder of Southern France and rumors of the approach of an English army, Clement VIII flees Avignon. The Pope, accompanied by his guards, abandons the papal residence and the fortress-city in haste. A large amount of treasure is simply left behind, as are various correspondences and financial accounts. Much of the information finds its way into the hands of the Romans and is used to good effect embarrassing their rivals.

1431: Death of Boniface IX. Claudius Berberini is elected as Pope Urban VII. He is an open partisan of the Roman Republic, and proclaims the war against Venice a crusade. His zeal for church reform is limited, and the demands of his hedonistic lifestyle soon leave him scrambling to sell offices and indulgences.

1432: Having become a ward of the Kingdom of Aragon, Clement VIII is finally resettled with a modest estate around the old castle of Peniscola. Creating a luxurious villa and building a modern fortress consume much of Clement's attentions and the Papal budget. The usual resorts of selling indulgences and offices fail to provide enough money, leaving Clement to demand exceptional tithes and press rulers for a "Jew tax" to be paid directly to the Church.

1434: Scandal of the Castelgandolfo. A luxurious party at the Papal estate is interrupted by a duel between a Rienzi and a Colonna. The death of both men causes a feud in the city. Within weeks rumors circulate that the duel was over the favors of the Pope's niece, serving as a prostitute at the affair.

1441: Decree of Urbino. Urban VII attacks the legitimacy of the Holy Roman Empire and declares the Roman Republic to be the true successor of Rome. He threatens formal excommunication of those rulers and Cardinals who still refuse to recognize his own authority. Clement VIII responds with a call for a Crusade against the Roman Republic to restore the unity of Christendom. The war of words between the pontiffs escalates over the rest of the year.

1442: Urban VII dies, allegedly of a fit of apoplexy. He is replaced by Marcantonio Rienzius, a nephew of the Princepes who adopts the title of John XXIII. The new pope does not follow up Urban's threats of mass excommunication.

1446: Death of Clement VIII. His successor is another Spaniard, Diego Guzman, who takes the name of Martin V.

1448: Failed attempt by envoys of Byzantine Emperor Constantine XI to negotiate a church union in exchange for military support. Efforts to negotiate with the Romans falter over the filoque clause and the uncertainty of gaining the backing of the Senate for a confrontation with the Ottomans. The Byzantine delegation does however bring an influx of Greek scholars into Western Europe.

1449: The Byzantines visit Peniscola for talks with Martin V. Aragon is not in a position to support the Empire and Martin V is even less flexible than the Romans on theological matters.

1451: Roman delegation to Bohemia to convince the Hussites to acknowledge John XXIII gets off to a bad start and never recovers. Cardinal Lucius Berberini denounces the "barbaric" practice of offering the host in two kinds to laity, while the Hussites are unwilling to concede the canonical supremacy of the Bishop of Rome. As a result, John XXIII issues a Bull condemning the "Bohemian heresy" as an error and denouncing any efforts to support similar innovations inside the Catholic Church.

1454: The Roman Republic saves Constantinople, and makes the remnant Byzantine Empire a protectorate. Under the terms of the Union of Ravenna negotiated afterward, the Roman Church and the Byzantine Church are united. Theological issues are universally resolved in favor of the Western perspective, but the actual practices of the Greek church are left untouched. The patriarch of Constantinople is forces to accept the supremacy of the Roman pontiff but is allowed to administer his Church without oversight. The union is rejected by the Patriarchs of Jerusalem and Alexandria, as well as by most Orthodox believers. It is also rejected by Martin V, who objects to the submission of the Patriarch to his rival.

1456: The partisans of Martin V in Germany purchase one of the first moveable type presses and run lurid propaganda attacking the Roman papacy. The flood of tracts manages to revive the scandals of Urban VII and undermine the prestige of the Roman succession.

1460: The first Vatican printing press is installed and used to further the "War of the Presses" raging between supporters of Martin V and John XXIII. Accusations of heresy, simony, corruption, sodomy, and theological laxity are commonly thrown around, bringing the entire Church into increasing disrepute.

1462: Death of John XXIII in a riding accident at Castelgandolfo. The Roman cardinals elect Aenas Piccolomini as Pope, who takes the name Pius II. He is the first non-Roman Pope in the Vatican since Urban VI, and pursues a more conciliatory policy toward the Schism. He also patronizes artists on a grand scale, pushing the Roman church further into debt.

1464: Under pressure from Emperor Frederick III, Martin ratifies the elevation of Burgundy to the status of a Kingdom. Pius II demurs such recognition in light of the English response, leaving Burgundy to abandon the pontiff in favor of his Spanish rival.

1465: The printing presses at the Vatican and in Peniscola increasingly turn to churning out indulgences as both pontiffs franticly attempt to buttress their finances.

1468: Secret negotiations between agents of Martin V and Pius II break up after it becomes apparent neither man is willing to resign their office. Discovering the talks make the Roman Senate suspicious of Pius II despite their complete failure.

1474: Death of Pius II. He is replaced by Roderigo Borgia, a Spanish rival of the Guzmans coopted into Roman service. His appointment is the result of arm-twisting by the Senate who want a reliable agent of the state in the Vatican. He takes the name of Alexander VI, and almost immediately turns the Vatican into a pleasure palace while expending vast sums of money on raucous parties with the Roman elite.

1476: Death of Martin V. His successor is another Spaniard with a reputation for probity, integrity, and determination to reform the deplorable practices of the Church. Tomas de Torquemada takes the name of Sixtus IV.

[The Duchess of Zeon]

The Most Orthodox and Christian Sovereign Khatun, Aiyurug II Feofaniya Bordžigin, Great Princess of Kiev and Ruler of the Rus from Coast to Coast, the Supreme Commandress of the Golden Horde and Protectress of the Orthodox Patriarchs and Peoples.