Ace Pace wrote:Your wrong, its the quiet religious types, who I actully enjoy talking too. Maybe I'm missing out on a group, because those I've met are usually very rich.
I see, although I'm still surprised to know the religious ones are actually the rich. I mean, Hassan Bolkiah has a floating sex palace he named "Tits" (I kid you not; the yacht's name is actually Tits), while in Indonesia, the upper-class mostly don't give much damn about
Syari'a either.
Here in my country, most Islamic fundies are people calling themselves 'new intellectuals'. They mostly come from less-educated background (family, parents, and the likes), but they manage to get university education.
When they enter the uni, they usually join mosque-based organization and such, and become fundies at one night! (I kid you not) They are also the same people who become the backbone of
Partai Keadilan Sejahtera (PKS); a very prominent fundie political party in Indonesia.
They're young people, and tend to be very impressionable (in fundie things). They are very fanatic in their fundie belief, although their polite and friendly facade often deceive. They are also very aware of education-based "caste"; an acquintance of mine got a grad scholarship to Georgia Tech, and became VERY pompous about it; hiding his arrogance behind false politeness and such.
It's very frustrating to debate against those self-proclaimed 'new intellectuals', because their tactics mostly consist 'evading the issue' and 'style over substance' fallacy. They tend to associate intellect with politeness and niceties. The fundie acquintance I described above refused to debate against me because my usage of the word 'fuck', which he claimed
unintellect.
People who come from educated background, on the other hand, are mostly moderates and not interested in fundamentalism. As for the upper class, they are more interested in indulging themselves!
(and the self-indulgent culture is often passed to their kids even if they're not rich anymore.
)
I'm not saying self-indulgent culture is bad, though. It contains positive things like 'enjoy your life' and 'there are things more important than money'. :D Some of my childhood friends are now pursuing 'non-lucrative' career and very dedicated in it; simply because they love it.
As for the older generations, even though they are more 'orthodox', are actually
much less fundie than these new generations. Long-established moslem organizations like
Nahdatul Ulama (NU) and old generation Islamic scholars like Abdurrahman Wahid ("Gus Dur") and Nurcholis Madjid are actually
very moderate. So in Indonesia, the word 'orthodox' is actually more associated with 'moderate'; it is the new radicals that scare people off with their hardline attitude.
In fact, the 'headscarf culture' was started by the young ones; my mom, who is religious, never wear headscarf (not to mention she told her students to stay away from fundie organizations; she's a lecturer), and women of her generation do not wear headscarf either.
Ace Pace wrote:And I'm not telling, its complex, and mostly involves ruining great memories of an area which had some of the best snow in Europe.
Ah, I see. Nothing beat a good adventure!
:thumbsup
