Developments in the Honorverse

Lord Iames Osari · Post by **Lord Iames Osari** » Tue Feb 20, 2007 12:59 am

Especially in the latest books, [spoilers]now that Pritchart, Theisman, and all the good-guy Havenites we've come to know and love are in charge. I was desperately hoping for a treaty all through At All Costs. I want there to be a treaty, and I want Mesa to be glassed.[/spoilers] Like this:

Fixed your spoiler tags. Thanks for playing the Game of Life. You win... nothing.

-Stofsk

fgalkin · Post by **fgalkin** » Tue Feb 20, 2007 1:03 am

Yes. They should join forces for a massive smackdown on Mesa and those Sollies that would protect them.

Have a very nice day.
-fgalkin

frigidmagi · Post by **frigidmagi** » Tue Feb 20, 2007 2:18 am

A series of books on the fall of the Solarian League would be huge fun to read yes.

Batman · Post by **Batman** » Tue Feb 20, 2007 9:34 am

Given that I was seething at the reopening of hostilities in 'War of Honor' you may note down my opinion as a solid 'HELL yes'. Mesa needs to be BDZ'd and the Solarian League needs to be taken down a peg or 15 if not outright done in.

Mayabird · Post by **Mayabird** » Tue Feb 20, 2007 3:43 pm

I can't get myself to care about the series anymore. I'm tired of the same ol' same ol' and the fall of the Solarian League from its own ponderous weight, Mesan corruption, and current restrictions on growth would be far more interesting. There'd still be plenty of opportunities for battle scenes as Manticore, Haven, and that German-analogue star empire fight for their survival against the desperate Solarian hordes.

Batman · Post by **Batman** » Tue Feb 20, 2007 4:08 pm

That'd be the Andermani Empire (and I still want to strangle Weber for his butechery of the german language).

frigidmagi · Post by **frigidmagi** » Tue Feb 20, 2007 4:22 pm

Well let's be fair Bats, the Andermani empire was founded by a crazed Mercenary leader who thought he was the reincarnation of Fredrick the Great or something and he did it by conqearing a bunch of planets that were inhabited by Chinese immigratents. The Andermani are very much Chinese pretending to be Germans in my view. So of course the language gets butchered. Not to mention the thousands of years of time difference.

Stofsk · Post by **Stofsk** » Tue Feb 20, 2007 7:46 pm

Kinda like in Firefly where the white guys speak something that sounds like mandarin.

Lord Iames Osari · Post by **Lord Iames Osari** » Wed Feb 21, 2007 8:04 am

Mayabird wrote:I can't get myself to care about the series anymore. I'm tired of the same ol' same ol' and the fall of the Solarian League from its own ponderous weight, Mesan corruption, and current restrictions on growth would be far more interesting. There'd still be plenty of opportunities for battle scenes as Manticore, Haven, and that German-analogue star empire fight for their survival against the desperate Solarian hordes.

I agree that it's getting to be the same ol' same ol', but I can't help but care about the characters. I :luv: the interactions between Honor and Mike and Alice and Tremain and Harkness and White Haven and Emily and Elizabeth and Nimitz and... well, just about everybody. And that's why I'll read the next book, and the one after that, and so on.

fgalkin · Post by **fgalkin** » Thu Feb 22, 2007 12:14 am

Meh. I always liked the space battles. The interactions between the characters got stale around book 4. And the less said about Nimitz or Honor's "marriage," the better.

Have a very nice day.
-fgalkin

Lord Iames Osari · Post by **Lord Iames Osari** » Thu Feb 22, 2007 12:22 am

fgalkin wrote:Meh. I always liked the space battles. The interactions between the characters got stale around book 4. And the less said about Nimitz or Honor's "marriage," the better.

Have a very nice day.
-fgalkin

*raises eyebrow* I must respectfully disagree with you about the interactions of the characters, then.

I must admit to being curious about your stance toward Nimitz and Honor's marriage, however.

Cpl Kendall · Post by **Cpl Kendall** » Fri Feb 23, 2007 3:35 pm

Wait, Nimitz and Honour are married to each other?

Lord Iames Osari · Post by **Lord Iames Osari** » Fri Feb 23, 2007 4:01 pm

>.<

NO.

Nimitz is married. Honor is married. Neither of them is married to the other. Although I suppose it could be argued that their bonding is, in a sense, similar.

Cpl Kendall · Post by **Cpl Kendall** » Fri Feb 23, 2007 4:39 pm

Lord Iames Osari wrote:>.<

NO.

Nimitz is married. Honor is married. Neither of them is married to the other. Although I suppose it could be argued that their bonding is, in a sense, similar.

Know I admit that I haven't read any further than The Honor of the Queen but has there been some drastic developments in treecat's that allows them to get married? I thought they were just dolphins with legs. And wouldn't a marriage drastically interefere with Nimitz spacegoing ways?

Lord Iames Osari · Post by **Lord Iames Osari** » Fri Feb 23, 2007 5:22 pm

Only to The Honor of the Gueen? Ok, so you wouldn't know about either of those developments, and I don't want to spoil it for you any further.

Cpl Kendall · Post by **Cpl Kendall** » Fri Feb 23, 2007 5:36 pm

Lord Iames Osari wrote:Only to The Honor of the Gueen? Ok, so you wouldn't know about either of those developments, and I don't want to spoil it for you any further.

Don't worry about it, I have no intention of reading further unless they get put up on the Baen Free Library.

frigidmagi · Post by **frigidmagi** » Fri Feb 23, 2007 6:18 pm

Short Victorious War is pretty good in my opinion.

fgalkin · Post by **fgalkin** » Fri Feb 23, 2007 7:08 pm

Lord Iames Osari wrote:
fgalkin wrote:Meh. I always liked the space battles. The interactions between the characters got stale around book 4. And the less said about Nimitz or Honor's "marriage," the better.

Have a very nice day.
-fgalkin
*raises eyebrow* I must respectfully disagree with you about the interactions of the characters, then.

I must admit to being curious about your stance toward Nimitz and Honor's marriage, however.

You mean aside from "the treecats are really as smart as humans, they just kept it hidden from humans, just because, until the Great and Mighty Honor Harrington comes along and revolutionized Human-treecat relations by developing a sign language that enables them to communicate with humans?"

As for the marriage, she's entering into a polygamous marriage with her mentor and father figure (and no one objects). Does that not strike you as a bit...odd?

Comrade Kendall wrote:Don't worry about it, I have no intention of reading further unless they get put up on the Baen Free Library.

Here.

Have a very nice day.
-fgalkin

Cynical Cat · Post by **Cynical Cat** » Fri Feb 23, 2007 7:24 pm

fgalkin wrote: You mean aside from "the treecats are really as smart as humans, they just kept it hidden from humans, just because, until the Great and Mighty Honor Harrington comes along and revolutionized Human-treecat relations by developing a sign language that enables them to communicate with humans?"

As for the marriage, she's entering into a polygamous marriage with her mentor and father figure (and no one objects). Does that not strike you as a bit...odd?

-fgalkin

It doesn't strike me as odd, but that's only because I have long since categorized Honor Harrington as a fantasy object, not a character. This just means she's become sexual fantasy object as well. Sad.

frigidmagi · Post by **frigidmagi** » Fri Feb 23, 2007 7:35 pm

You know that's one of the things that ruined the later series for me was this out of nowhere thing between her and White Haven. It literally just happens out of nowhere in Honor Among Enemies... Pretty much because White Haven saw her for the first time in a dress... WTF? It's things like this that let you know the editors have stopped paying attention to a writer I think.

Cynical Cat · Post by **Cynical Cat** » Fri Feb 23, 2007 7:40 pm

frigidmagi wrote:You know that's one of the things that ruined the later series for me was this out of nowhere thing between her and White Haven. It literally just happens out of nowhere in Honor Among Enemies... Pretty much because White Haven saw her for the first time in a dress... WTF? It's things like this that let you know the editors have stopped paying attention to a writer I think.

No, its a sign that Weber sells well enough that the editors don't try to rock the boat. The Honor verse was always somewhat contrived, but Honor has slid from strong protagonist to Mary Sue to full blown fantasy object. Sad.

Lord Iames Osari · Post by **Lord Iames Osari** » Fri Feb 23, 2007 9:05 pm

fgalkin wrote:You mean aside from "the treecats are really as smart as humans, they just kept it hidden from humans, just because, until the Great and Mighty Honor Harrington comes along and revolutionized Human-treecat relations by developing a sign language that enables them to communicate with humans?"

I for one think that the treecats had a very good reason to conceal their true intelligence.

fgalkin wrote:As for the marriage, she's entering into a polygamous marriage with her mentor and father figure (and no one objects). Does that not strike you as a bit...odd?

Ok. Polygamous marriage. What's so wrong about it? The Bible is chock full of polygamy. All of the people involved (Honor, Hamish, Emily) are involved of their own free will, so I don't see where the problem lies with this.

As for White Haven being a mentor and father figure, I'm afraid I don't quite see it. As far as I can tell from my reading of the series, White Haven and Honor have never had any teacher-student relationship. It's true that they shared the friendship (and I think mentorship, though I could be misremembering) of Raoul Courvosier, but that's a different dynamic than the one you're trying to ascribe.

As for White Haven being a father figure for Honor, I don't see that either. Even leaving aside the fact that Honor's real father is still alive, was involved in her upbringing, and woud thus tend to fill the need for a father figure (by, you know, being her father), I never got the sense that Honor saw White Haven in that way.

I will grant that the whole thing did come out of nowhere, though.

Cynical Cat · Post by **Cynical Cat** » Sat Feb 24, 2007 5:48 am

White Haven was Honor's mentor and patron in the Manticoran Navy. You don't have to read very far into the series to get that. Marrying your protege whose career you've supported and boosted smells like dead fish. And Honor Harrington in a group marriages? Please, that sounds like bad fan fiction.

And the tree cats are practically treated as avatars of Shiva at the beginning of the series. They have every incentive to communicate effectively with humans because they are pandered to in the way house cats can only dream of. What is "send food back and have them prepare the exact same course, but delivered three degree Celsius hotter bitch" in tree cat hand sign, because that's what they get away with. But of course, only Honor is capable of making this crucial breakthrough, not one of the other tree cat owners, which includes the Manticoran royalty and the pedestals they are placed on.

The tree cat wanking was a little much. Even for me. In the early books. That should tell you something.

Cpl Kendall · Post by **Cpl Kendall** » Sat Feb 24, 2007 10:59 am

fgalkin wrote: Here.

Have a very nice day.
-fgalkin

Thanks Comrade.

Ra · Post by Ra » Sat Feb 24, 2007 11:32 am

I probably shouldn't have spoiled myself, but after reading this I'm somewhat glad I never got too far into the second book, let alone beyond; Basilisk Station was a good read, but if the Honorverse has gotten this bad, I think I'll pass.

LibriumArcana.Games

Developments in the Honorverse

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